The last person in the world that I would want to irritate, would be the one doing delicate work on my spine. So unless you plan to go to a new neurosurgeon ...

"C"

Yep, yep, & yep. Sounds about the way my surgeons office conducts business. Absolutely inhumane! My husband got so frustrated, he reported them to HR dept. @ the hospital. I was too scared to say anything, it's MY neck that's in their hands. All this bad behavior from staff came on AFTER the surgery was over. I had to go see another neuro for post op care. Now that it's all over, I have put word on the street, warning others not to go to him. Maybe something you could do afterwards. So sorry.

I agree unless you are ready/able to switch I would say mum....

MAYBE you could ask him if there is an easier way to reach him ?????

The neurologist the surgeon sent me to called me back (really did like this neurologist), any way he told me that the MRI showed that my C spine was ok, but that there was an artifact on the Thoracic spine that needs further investigation, so I am having that MRI on Wed. Can anyone tell me what symptoms go along with the T spine? I am having tingling on the pinky side of my arm, into the pinky and ring finger and pain in the upper arm. The other pain I am having in my back I thought was muscular, it extends from the upper middle of my back down to above my waist. I am glad that answers are close, and will take it slowly. As for telling my surgeon off, I want to, but won't, not till I don't have to see him again. As far as his office goes, I have worked with and for enough doctors that I know the office is doing what he wants them to do. His office manager is giving medical advice because he doesn't want to call patients back. As far as the service goes, they were very nice and was happy to be able to put my last call in as a third call....I just hope what ever is going on can be handled without surgery, because there is no way I am having surgery in the near future.

ilene

Count me out of the doctor worship/fear group. Respect is an earned reward, not a gift. Yes, I can respect someone with the persistence to do the years of medical school and further training for a specialty, but I also respect those who manage their lives without a medical degree and a seven-figure income. And respect has to go both ways.

In the last two years, I've spent about six months in ICUs with my dad, who has COPD with asthma and emphysema, senile dementia and brain damage from a fall, and who had a quadruple bypass at 83 during which every possible thing that could go wrong did. That's all in addition to my own health issues. There are good doctors and bad doctors just like there are good cops and bad cops, good contractors and bad contractors. Going to medical school makes you A doctor, but not necessarily a good one, and being a good doctor doesn't necessarily translate into being a good person.

My own cardiologist, for example, is a saint on this earth, but the senior partner in his practice is a giant putz. Both the partners of my dad's pulmonologist left a very successful practice to go back to working in a teaching hospital because his ego was taking up all the space in the office. The hospital staff calls him "Spanky" behind his back, and he's known for saying criminally insulting things to the hospital staff ("You're nothing but a West Virginia inbred idiot") and then daring them to report him because he'll claim anti-semitism and get them fired.

If you think you are being abused by your doctor, ask yourself "Is this the same treatment he would give his wife or daughter?" If the answer is "No" then it's time to find a new doctor, and if you truly believe that your doctor would do something unethical during surgery because you've criticized him, it's time to do it today.

TitanNeck

HI Ilene

SOrry to hear about your new problems. If I were you I would casually let the doctor know that it was very hard to get to him when you needed him. If he cares he will pick up on what you say - if not he will ignor you. If enough peeps say something it might make a difference to him.

As far as T-spine that's where my problems are. There is very little info out there on upper thoracic problems. I was told that this is because it is very hard to injury this area of the spine because it is connected to the rib cage. I think it is also because surgery in the area is very difficult because there is so much in the way and often they have to cut ribs which is very painful and a hard recovery. Unless you are desperate most seem to opt out of surgery.

My problem is at t1/t2. Generally the T1 nerve root seems to run down the inside of your arm to your finger tips. However I found some info today that says it can also be the top of the shoulder and down around the rib cage as a muscle type achy pain. RIght now my neurologist, orthopedist and 2 surgeons each have a different opinion of how successful surgery would be. Orthosurgeon won't even consider surgery at that site. Neurosurgeon says it is not that hard and will cure everything immediately. Recovery of the area is biggest concern because they go in through the back of the neck and have to move muscle etc.

Have they told you where they think the problem is coming from? The EMG should have given a good idea.

When do you have your MRI? I would really like to keep in touch. You will find that there are very few people on here with problems in this area.

Hi ilene,

First of all I am so sorry to hear about trying to contact your doctor and I can sure empathize with what you are going through. I posted previously I had surgery on the sixth and had and anterior disectomy with fusion at c5 and c6 with pain on left side after surgery almost immediately started having pain on right side. I tried to contact the doctor monday morning the ninth and he was on vacation ended up in ER on early tuesday morning and I guess the orthopedic covering said to have me go home after they gave me pain medication wonderful. On Wens the 11th the doctor finally called me back and gave me prescription of cortizone pack which did help with the pain a bit because two percocets were not helping. I spoke to him briefly and he said I should come in sooner than the 23rd which is my next appt. I called the office the next day the 12th saying that I needed an newer appt and asking if putting my arm in a sling would hurt my neck due to the pain. Trying to make this short sorry but so furustrating and she said the doctor was in OR for two days !! I just said great and I called today left a message and no call back once again...Sometimes I think the office people are just too busy or the doctor is too busy but phone calls should be returned !!! The office manager should not give medical advice. Doctors are people just like us and they should treat people with respect. I do intend to tell the doctor how upset I am with not getting a call back if I could drive I would go to the office myself and tell them so. If you are upset I would address the situaion in a calm manner and let your doctor know how much pain you were in and ask him what would you do ??? I do hope you feel better soon and you are not alone when wanting to tell someone off !!! Corina

I have worked in the medical field as an echocardiographer since 1979, both in radiology and cardiology. I have worked with all kinds of doctors, both good and bad, and remember the ones that come in thru the patient waiting room 2 hours late on office day because he got off seeing a full office of people waiting for him. I have also worked with woderful doctors who were wonderful people too. I know it's the doctor, and not the staff...I know the kind of person this doctor is, and don't think me saying anything to him will effect him, because he truly thinks he is better then the rest of us, unfortunately.

But getting back to me. I am most worried that the artifact seen can be a frament of bone in my spine that broke off during surgery. From my symptoms the nerve being affected is T1, but was told the artifact was seen on the spine...I wonder if it is on the cord...or hopefully something that is just an artifact and not there at all, which I really don't think, since my symptoms are real. The tingling is in my lower arm going into my pinkey and ring finger, the upper arm and shoulder of both arms hurt a lot. Prior to surgery the tingling was on the side of my thumb, my thumb being the worse, and my upper arm hurt in a similar way from neck down. As soon as the other side of arm tingled, I knew it had to be a differnt nerve. The pain in my back radiates down the spine, but my trap muscles are so tight, I think it cam be from that too and not the T spine there. I have had a nurogenic bladder since 2001 when I recovered from my lumbar surgery, but now time voiding isn't working, I have no rhyme or reason to when I go, which remains my biggest complaint. My MRI is on Wed, my post op visit is after the MRI.
Cornia I am happy you are seeing your surgeon sooner...hope you get to the bottom of what is going on.

ilene

I want the magic wand treatment please.

Rina those EMGs are not necessarily accurate. I saw one article that said it was only a tool to find problems in some people and that it did not work in all cases. In my case I have a herniation pressing on the t1 nerve but the emg showed only a few boarderline results.

So would someone please pass me the magic wand so I can make all of this go away?

I wish there was a magic wond, if you find one let me know, I will be next in line to use it!..lol

ilene

Hi Ilene,

I hope you don't mind me junping on your bandwagon, but I also need to 'vent' about my neurosurgeon!

In the UK, you can use the NHS to see the consultant free of charge, or pay an astronomical amount to see the same person privately.

After 12 months' misdiagnosis by the NHS' radiologist (different neurosurgeon), I paid the extortionate amount to see him privately. As I left his office, he handed me a beautifully-folded letter and a card with his telephone number and his email address. His parting words were, "If you need to contact me for any reason, please email or ring me straight away." How kind I thought.

The beautifully-folded letter turned out to be his outrageous bill.

Within a week of seeing him, I was in so much pain that I rang and was told that my call would be brought to his attention. I waited and nothing! So I emailed as well and was told that my email wouldbe brought to his attention. I waited and nothing!

It seems over here they're happy-enough to take your credit card, but their level of care does not extend to the courtesy of replying to calls or emails.

Last time I saw him, the first thing he did was to speed-read the email I'd sent him weeks before! It's so comforting to know you're in such good hands.

Val
PS He's also always late for his appointments which is infuriating, given the nature of his patients' problems.

At least we know that nasty doctors are universal and not limited to the US. That said, this could spur a whole conversation on nationalized health care. My best friend is a Brit living in the US; her mom got great care in England, but it was too late to save her life.

As it happens, my neuro is a first generation Italian immigrant; her mom is still in Italy. Around the same time that I had my fusion, three years ago, her mom presented with symptoms in Italy indicative of a C5-7 herniation. She waited on a list for nine months to get an MRI, and when it was her turn, "they" decided she didn't need it. Needless to say, my neuro is vehemently opposed to nationalizing health care, sacrificing more control over our own health than we have already lost to the insurance companies.

The point is, what happens to the treatment we get if we no longer have the choice to tell a sorry doctor where to get off?

For example, my last headache neuro before my current one put me on Elavil for the headaches. I had lost 80 lbs. in the previous two years, and in the first month on Elavel, I gained 20 back. I had already talked to my pharmacist who told me it was VERY common. So when I saw the neuro again, a man about 5'8" and weighing every bit of 140 lbs., I told him that I was indeed sleeping better and the headaches were more manageable, but that I had gained 20 lbs in four weeks. And he said to me "If I gain 2 lbs. I'm on a diet the next day. If you're having trouble with your weight, YOU need to get some self control." And then I said "I must have some self control, because you're still standing upright." And I walked out.

What would have happend if I hadn't had other choices? And just for the record, every medical professional in town has echoed my opinion of the idiot. When I repeated the story to my GP, who had referred me to him, he laughed til tears rolled down his face and repeated the story all over the office.

Upshot: medical care is a consumer service, in many ways no different than hiring a lawyer or choosing an insurance agent or a stock broker. These are people we wouldn't hesitate to fire, or to state our opinions to if we were displeased; why are we hesitant with doctors?

In the last two years, my mom has fired THREE of my dad's doctors, and it was absolutely cathartic. Of the three, the pulmonologist was the biggest jerk. He had independently decided that my dad needed to die and he had put out the word in ICU to allow that to happen. I don't know when it got to be his decision to make, but Someone more important decided NOT. And put me in the room to make sure that he received all the care necessary, care that would clearly have been withheld had I not been there, and which the nursing staff INTENDED to withhold whether I was there or not. Which reminds me to say to everyone: No matter how much you trust your doctor, do NOT go for surgery without an advocate to speak for you, even if it's just to make sure you get your meds on time and enough water to drink. "Prone" is not a position of strength.

Rant over..... for now.

TitanNeck

I LOVE IT TITAN!!!! YOU "GET IT ON" WITH YOUR "SELF CONTROL"! That is the BEST thing I have read in here, for 7 mos now! And "hats off to YOU" for standing up to that ICU dr who wanted to put your dad away. My gosh - they really do think they are God. Perfect example! Yes, we have to be extreeeeeemly cautious! Thx for sharing! We reported my surgeon to the HR Dept in the hospital, with an investigation. I don't know what's going to become of this nationalized health care. It's all pretty scarry.

It runs in the family. My sister was seeing a doctor in a nearby town for a number of reasons. She has Hashimoto's Disease and Reynaud's Syndrome, both autoimmune disorders, which sets her up as a likely candidate for more autoimmunes. Her doctor was testing her for lupus, probably 15 years ago. He told her that even if this particular titer was negative, her likelihood for being diagnosed with lupus at a future time was higher than 95%. She waited DAYS for the path report, and then the doctor had it but wouldn't let the nurse tell her what it said nor would he make time to see my sister before the end of the second week to discuss it with her. When she showed up at his office, she backed him up against a wall with her finger in his chest and explained to him in one syllable words that she was certain he would not be so cavalier if she was his wife or mother or daughter. The titer was on the high side of normal, and believing what he said about the 95% likelihood, she planned her life around it. She knew that becoming pregnant could be a trigger for lupus but eventually decided to have children anyway. Two children, still no lupus. So, having moved to a different part of the state, she sought the advice of another doctor, who again ran the test. Results: no lupus, no indication that she was EVER in danger of having lupus, she can stop worrying about it. Fifteen YEARS she assumed she was going to get a debilitating disease and planned her life accordingly.

You don't have to spend much time in a hospital before you find out that doctors are just as human as everyone else, or in some cases, just as savage as everyone else. Once that barrier that they put up as a group is broken, you should be able to treat them like everyone else.

I tell all the incidents as funny stories now, but in reality I wasn't sure that either of my parents would survive it. When the pulmonologist told me "You're going to have to make a decision about turning off that vent this week" I said "You can say that to me, but don't you even whisper it or think the words in my mother's presence." He got tired of dealing with us and told my mom (after my dad came home from the hospital despite his best efforts) that he didn't want to do his regular care (he has COPD with asthma and emphysema, so most of his regular care REQUIRES the input of a lung doctor) and referred them to a new GP. THIS guy, after talking to my mom on the phone one fine day, diagnosed my dad with pneumonia OVER THE PHONE. He got fired too.

But they're not all B-wipes. One of my all time favorite doctors is my PM guy. Everyone who ever saw him once lights up like a Christmas tree when you mention his name, and he makes what can be an unpleasant procedure as easy as pie, chatting like regular people about his new dog or his car trouble, etc. until the thing is over with and you didn't notice he'd done it. I've always said that if you had five hundred people in a room and you were told ONE of them was a doctor, he'd be the very last person you'd ask. That's the way they all should be.

TitanNeck

Just an update my doctor did call me yesterday and apologized for not calling back sooner he advised since I am feeling a bit better could possibly be a joint problem from the poisition maybe on the OR table. I did thank him for calling back and the first words when he spoke to me was an apology so it does make a difference . I worked at a hospital for almost seven years when I was younger and have many stories. Titan I was happy to hear that you have stated how you felt because it is your health and the doctor should have not been so ignorant to tell you to have self control. I have been overweight most of my life and had one doctor who treated my mother who is thin and said well you mother is thin and I said well I am not my mother, and even though this surgeon has a good repuation I will not go back to him...he can kiss my fat butt like I dont know I am overweight !! Oh well my rant is now over lol...

I'm glad I did something worthwhile today. Otherwise, I basically vegetated in my chair, literally. It's funny that my coworkers think I am 120% too serious 126% of the time, yet on this topic I just have to laugh. What's the other option? And I've got a million stories, based on nearly nine years in retail and 25 years of parenthood. I keep them sorted in my mind so I'll have something I can keep a client entertained with while I'm doing the boring part of drawing their kitchen. I'll see what I can come up with for the next edition.

TitanNeck

I have a larege hernition with cord compression and mild cord flattening between c-6/c-7...has anyone tried the triton DTS machine that decompresses the discs for pain relief? I'm thinking about it but afraid that I'll end up in more pain. Wanted to know if any here have tried it and have gotten any relief. Thanks.

Hi Peaceln

Is that a traction machine? I tried traction with no relief for a herniated disc. SOme people swear by them.

If that isn't what it is could you describe it?

My surgeon told me that I had 3 hernaited discs in the T spine, but none of these are compressing the spine and they don't need surgery. He said PT and antiflamatory medication will help them. He also said that my Bladder problems are not coming form my spine. I had the MRI 1 hours before my apt with him and there was no report generated yet, in fact I don't think the radiologist even looked at them, but was glad to hear his opinion. I plan on following up with the neurologist, and will also go to a urololgist, but will do that closer to where I live. Yesterday was a hard day, left my house at 9:30 for an 11:30 MRI, got done with it just in time for surgeons apt, at 1:00, but not surprising wasn't taken into exam room till 3:00, and he didn't walk in till 3:30 and spent an entire 5 minutes with me. Was glad to see that there was nothing in the spine, will try the prescription he gave me, and think I will switch PT's am wondering if she irritated something, because she may be a bit to agesive for me.

Thanks for those great stories too, enjoyed the laugh!

hope everyone has a pain free day!
ilene

How did the doctor know you had 3 herniated discs without seeing the report? Either I am misunderstanding or something sounds strange. I would definately get a copy of those films and the report from the radiologist.

I had the MRI done in at the hospital radiology office and he was able to look at the MRI on the computer before the radiologist even saw them, or gave a preliminary report. I did ask him if the radiologist saw them yet, and he said NO, but that he looked at it and there is nothing major going on, nothing to be giving me the symptoms I am having. I do know this surgeon came highly recommended, unfortunately for me he came recommended to me by physitians who for sure get treated differently then I have. As for him giving me his opinion of the films, it's ok, but will get the official report and already got a copy of the films, and am waiting to hear what the neurologist has to say about them.

Thanks again,
ilene

Kris, I assume Ilene's NS looked at the films since the report wasn't ready.

That aside, Ilene, his treatment of you is completely unconscionable. Are there no other NSs in your area? There is absolutely no reason for overbooking to that degree; the excuse is that he makes more money if he sees more patients. No reason would be good enough; that reason just makes me want to vomit. If we, as patients, got to charge the doctors as much for the time we sit and wait as they do for the five minutes they spend with us, they'd stop doing that. That's why a free-market health care community is so important; if you don't like it, you can LEAVE.

I'm glad you're not looking at surgery, Ilene. This is a sucky time of year to have it.

Brenda, I've got some of those stories, too. With retail comes scheisty shoplifters and some other strange behavior. Most people wouldn't believe the things they will do in order to steal a dollar's worth of someone else's belongings.

TitanNeck

My experience makes me wary of the doctors reading the MRI films themselves. I was lucky that I had an extremely experienced radiologist do my first MRI reading. He spotted the problem that was on the edge of the first films and suggested a follow-up.

My ortho said he agreed and sent me to an ortho spine surgeon. That guy I could strangle. He blew me off saying that he didn't see anything and at least I had a herniation to add to my lawsuit!!

I believed him and went to a neurologist who said he saw the herniation but it couldn't be causing my pain. Gee wikipedia shows in detail just how this pain comes from that herniation.....but I guess his PT department can fix a herniation.

When nothing worked I went back to my ortho looking for some other source of pain and he said "why doesn't anyone fix the problem". So I went to a neuro-surgeon who admitted he would never have spotted that herniation on his own. And he counted out the vertebra a few times before he understood what the radiologist saw. Once he understood what the radiologist said he agreed that this is the source of my pain.

SO my point is everyone has a specialty that they are trained for. A radiologist looks at these reports all day long and knows how to spot things that other doctors may only see once a month or once a year. In my case the radiologist was right and two doctors were too dense to admit they couldn't see the problem on the films.

Titan you are right on the money. If only we could protest doctors who treat us this way but when a doctor is good he will always have more patients. But Ilene I really wonder how this doctor saw you for the first time today and in 5 minutes got your whole medical history, did an exam, read the MRI films himself and diagnosed the problem and wrote prescriptions. When you get the written report look at it carefully. If it differs from what the doctor told you it might be a good idea to take it to another doctor.

I don't mean to be a downer but something just doesn't seem right.