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I've read so much about pain meds...

AnonymousUserAAnonymousUser Posts: 49,671
edited 06/11/2012 - 8:48 AM in Chronic Pain
I wish I could figure out what the HECK to do! I KNOW I am undermedicated, but there are NO other doctors around. I am in misery several hours a day, and I mean all out war! 4 pills does not cut it for me, not working 9 hours a day plus taking care of a small farm, yard and family. It is not working. I have talked my fool head off to no avail. Doctors do not know it all, sometimes they just don't care. I always take an extra pill here and there because I cannot sit thru 2 hours of screeching nerve pain and wait. Then by the end of the month, I suffer insanely for a week. I always tell myself, I am not going to do that again, but it's always the same. When I hurt that bad, I just say F it and take one. That relief when that shocking pain starts ebbing away, well there is nothing quite like that. I know I can feel my pounding heart slow down, I feel at ease. It never goes all the way away, but enough so life is bearable. I have tried the ER morphine and different things that turn me into a zombie, which I hate. I just do not know how to get a handle on this thing - I really don't and I'm so damn sick of it. Anyone ever wonder if that is part of what the drug dealer problem really is? Undertreated pain. Who knows that half the people that buy from them aren't in that boat? I have wondered about it, well in this state anyway.


  • I have a number of sources of pain. Acute and the bone pain, are handled best -for me with the narcs.

    The nerves - in my spine - and ache stuff is best looked after by the Tens, heat, cold, and things that hit the that source.

    The all over aches- is best with Lyrica, Amitryp, diazapan, and a few others.

    Celebrex - gave me some relief from the bone - arthritis , but gave me so many side effects, including back pain, that I had to stop.

    I follow the advice on the Fibro people and get 2 showers a day. One in the am - and one at night.

    and some days - nothing works, except a good attitude. Take care!
  • from all your work and family and a running a farm...do you see a pm at all even if you have to travel far once a month maybe worth it to get some relief..
    there's not much helps me when i get a severe flar up with fibro...i was just put in hospital but as you stated felt like a zombie...
    for myself i know the trigger is stress and i just had my guard down and everyone was pulling me in diff.directions...so i need to learn to say stop and just take care of me....
    its hard to do but its a must...i'm getting back into going to the pool (if i need to beg for a ride and for the money) i shall do it..
    the water is the only time i dont feel pain...so if you need to take few warm to hot baths a day...
    with epsom salts they have lavender ones....
    the docs will and have upped my meds but which gives some relief but i just hate the way most of them make me feel...
    were are you from....what area? if you are not getting proper pain relief from your doc perhaps you need to do some research...
    and if you have been on the same pain meds for awhile perhaps you need to come off of them or switch...
    please dont take more than you are perscribed i do know the pain you feel but if you do that the doc can cut you off of the meds you are on....
    i do agree with you on most docs do not care and i swear i've met alot of them but i'm persistant with docs and i just keep searching till i find ones that do listen...and it takes alot of energy for sure...
    i so agree that good attitude does help and its very hard to have that when pains at it's worse...but you gotta try and be your own boss and make these docs listen to you...
    i have been thru alot of them so i know how frusterating it can be..

    sorry for rambling and my fibro brain doesn't let me communicate and as u can see spell very well
    neck,bone spurs pain started 04, back issues and fusion l4,l5 06~hardware removed.
    good few yrs. 09 pain sharp, numbness feet,legs, diagnosed fibro, neurop. legs.lung issues.
    daily goal do good thing for someone.
  • In this state (Utah) it is hard to find anyone that will take on a PM patient. The one I see does PM, but is the only one around. I'm going to have to take to her again tho, I can see that. This just isn't working for me and I surely cannot afford to give up my job. I have been here almost 31 years now and 5 1/2 more to go and I can retire with a nice pension. No options on this one...
  • There are other ER meds besides morphine, but most of us got here by working with our pain doctors and trying a lot of things that didn't work to find something that did.

    The fact that she's offered you a long-acting means that she doesn't not care. She wants to work with you. So work with her. Try a few things. You're going to have to give them a few weeks find out how they really feel, they all are going to make you feel like a zombie at first. Some might get better after 2 weeks, some might not. There might be ways around it if one is exceptionally good at pain control.

    My doctor never gave me the option of just taking more Hydrocodone either, but he gave me a lot of other options, and luckily a few of them have worked pretty well. I always made it clear that I was open to trying out his suggestions, and I would give him honest feedback on them.

  • I understand Mouse.
    To be in screaming pain and NOT take medication that you know will ease your torture is almost impossible, even when you know you will pay the price later.
    I wish I had an answer for you my friend. I too, know what it is like to suffer needlessley.
    Even with my pain pump I still have flare ups that are savage and I have to take an extra oral pain pill during those times. Then it's only good for 3 hours and I am back in agony again.
    BTW Pain pumps only take care of your "normal" pain level. That is why I have oral pain meds, for these flare ups. But my Doctor only gives me 3 a day now and during flare ups, that is not enough.

    Sending a big hug... >:D<
    Patsy W
  • I would try other things, but the fact is, I need to be to work everyday for 9 hours a day - period. I can't not drive and I can't not work. I'm just sick of the whole thing. It would be nice to have a few weeks to try other options and lollygag around to see if they do or don't work, but that isn't an option in my world and it does suck, it sucks the big one.
  • Dealers exist because people need what they sell. Lots of people start off with prescriptions from their doctors and then get hooked. The drug works less and the craving gets worse. I met a really sweet young couple who had their lives ruined by this...his dealer was his sister...how about that for sucky!!

    Mouse you really need to talk to your doctor. Maybe you need to see if anything has changed to cause increased pain. If not it's probably that the med you are on isn't working as well any more. Maybe a change will give you enough of a drug holiday that you could go back and get the same relief you used to get. But self-medicating is not the answer, especially on a continual basis.
  • Mouse, I think you're making it a bigger issue than it is- people try new meds all the time without quitting their jobs for a month. You just need to try a low dose and titrate slowly!

    I managed to get my kids to school every day during my med trials, I never felt like I couldn't drive. I drove myself to my doctor's appts- to tell you the truth, my BP med trials were more traumatic than my pain med trials.

    But staying at an impasse with your doctor isn't getting you anywhere. You know she isn't budging. So that leaves one of you.
  • I was thinking about this last night- how much trouble this could cause you in the long run, and how much relief you could get if you would just *try* some of the other tools your doctor has in her toolbox.

    She clearly is not comfortable prescribing high dosages of opiates. So what is going to happen if you need surgery? Will she let you bump up to oxy, or is she going to think you've been a good girl with your hydro all this time. Your up and down dosages could leave you with tolerance issues that come back to bite you.

    Just remember. "What are my options?" should be your favorite phrase in pain management. "I have tried that one, at x dosage, and it made me really groggy- what are my options?" "The hydrocodone are still working really well, but they are only lasting X hours, do I have any other options?"

    Throw the ball into their court, but you've gotta be ready to catch when they toss it back. You can start on a very low dose of a long-acting and ramp up, the idea is that when you find the "right" one, it will start hitting the pain long before you hit the side effects. Otherwise you ditch it.

    I sacrifice a great deal of mental acuity to pain management because I have to. But I tried a few and reached a balance I was comfortable with. I think you could too, but you'd have to try something other than what you feel comfortable with.

  • This is only my opinion, not directed at anyone, but please listen to how I have worked with my Dr, while working him to where I needed him to move.

    I went to him - and started with the fact that I ache - 24/7 - have for years, have used T1's by the bucket load, Robax and every OTC med known. I told him that I was taking advice from the pharmacist, as he [my Dr] was not listening to my issues. My sweetheart - wrote him a note, that she was concerned for me, and the fact that the pain I live with each day, interferes with daily interactions.

    I went for rounds of tests, 2 sets of full spine Xrays, and each time - I was flat on the table - when they were shot. They did not include the lumbar, where the history of my problems exist.

    At the same time - I was sent to a pain Psycol - to look me over for addiction issues. I was blunt, that I knew exactly what I needed, some form of pain control and then after I got back some of my quality of life, I would be interested in other things. I pointed out that - I was a mediator - for 20 years - at that time. I did affect my pain, but I had gotten to a point, where all of those holistic things were being used, with not too many positive results.

    I waited for the pain psyc to put his notes to the Dr. He dictated the message - in front of me, and told me that I was right, on almost all fronts. He felt I needed narcs - as my visits to ER had proven that on the short-term - they helped, and he recommended more classes of meds, that directly helped me, in subtle and sometimes dramatic ways.

    I still worked! Yes, I was worried about being on meds, and driving. My wife however told me - that she watched how I drove, when I was in pain, and how I drove when I had some measure of pain control.

    She said that when I had no meds, I drove so cautiously, that I was a hazard. She said that I drove like I was 90, rechecking things 4 and 5 times, like I could not recall doing it.
    On meds - she said that I drove more normally, I was still a cuatious driver, defensive and still, she saw me as safer, when I had pain control. As she put it, you can talk when you have meds, you cannot when you dont, have pain control.

    As things progressed - I never pushed my dr - for any specific med - I would tell him that he was in charge of it, but when he would not script other classes of meds, and I went through a couple of appts with him, I just pulled out my copy of the report that was sent to him by the pain Dr and quoted "that such and such class of meds, would be helpful to this patient." He pulled his copy out, read it and then asked me what I wanted to do? I always looked at him - and asked him, would you be comfortable in trying this? Because I would be, can we see if it works and if not - I'll quit it - because you know that I quit anything that does not work!

    So - I tell him what is up with me. I do tell him when I feel worse and I also tell him - "you know - I am almost to the point where I feel like asking for an increase, but I wonder if things have changed or if the meds are not working, or is there something that would help more - than an increase in meds -narcs - at this time."

    With that, I am on my way, for another round of tests. The 6th, in 5 years. To see why I am aching so much recently.

    One thing - is that I have had to accept, that there are some things I just cannot do. I cannot changes the tires on my car or truck. There are many significant thigns that I cannot do, or have modified, to allow me to enjoy life. Sex is something that has been modified greatly, and yet, I still enjoy a very exciting and my sweethreat is fullfilled too.

    No - I cannot work as hard or as long as I use to. But I work away. I never feel like I am wasting my time, even on a day like today, when I am home, for the second day in a row, on the couch - and walking, because I ache and am not feeling well enough to get to work. I would rather take a sick day. And I certainly hope that you all do have that benefit, but I know that I am in a minority.

    Do take care!
  • You know, after some of the PMs I have received from you, I think I made it pretty clear that your opinion means “Jack” to me. Don’t waste your time helping me with your “advice” – I don’t play that way. I think we have a pretty fair idea of where we stand, so lets just drop the BS. Not being rude, but there is no point in you responding to my posts after some of the other things you have said to me. No need to play nice here, so lets just let that dog lay…
  • Thanks, those are some good points. I will have to ponder some of these ideas and see if I can maybe find a different way to talk to her. It’s like talking to a wall. Someone else had a good idea about maybe asking for an ER med that would work throughout the night. That way, I wouldn’t feel the effects of the dopiness since I’d hopefully be sleeping and then by morning it would wear off. Usually I’m up at midnight taking a pain pill and another at 5 in the morning when I get up to get ready to feed animals and get ready for work. I’m fairly vain too , so I sit on the couch putting my make up on and such while I’m waiting for it to kick in, then I get dressed and go out and feed the animals before I leave. Maybe that way, I could save the 4 pills for during the day and it would work out well.
  • I just started taking a more frequent dose of Oxycontin and when I woke up today I got right out of bed. It usually takes me at lest 20 minutes to get up as my foot is asleep and had so much morning pain. The ER med is working for me so far. I wonder if your Dr. could try another ER med with you since morphine made you unwell. When I started MS Contin ER med and Oxycontin earlier this year I felt tired at first but not anymore. I hope your PM Dr. can help you this time. Take care. Charry
    DDD of lumbar spine with sciatica to left hip,leg and foot. L4-L5 posterior disc bulge with prominent facets, L5-S1 prominent facets with a posterior osteocartilaginous bar. Mild bilateral foraminal narrowing c-spine c4-c7 RN
  • Hello "M"...:). I am going to send you a PM...cause I dont want to post this so everyone can see it!! :)
  • Mouse said:
    You know, after some of the PMs I have received from you, I think I made it pretty clear that your opinion means “Jack” to me. Don’t waste your time helping me with your “advice” – I don’t play that way. I think we have a pretty fair idea of where we stand, so lets just drop the BS. Not being rude, but there is no point in you responding to my posts after some of the other things you have said to me. No need to play nice here, so lets just let that dog lay…

    Playing nice is actually something we do here. So I was doing so. And will continue to do so.

    p.s. You might want to re-read the last PM you sent me for truth.
  • That is what someone else suggested for night time, just one low dose oxycontin to see if that might make the difference I need. I just hope she doesn't get mad if I ask the question. Jeez, it is just not comfortable, but I guess I have nothing to gain unless I ask her. What's she gonna do - boot me out? My insurance is putting one of her kids thru college so I doubt it :)
  • Have you read - "how to win friends and influence people" Trust me - study it and use the techniques! For 20 years, I have used them as my bible for getting things done.

    Another - "Tsun Zu - the art of War." 1000's of years of history, going into that one! Use the techniques - to move people where you need them.

    I don't manipulate people - just present ideas and allow them to adopt ones that they see improve their lives.
  • Dr.,do you think it's time,or do you feel it would be a good idea to.....
    ..and never say never.lol.

    With the medication you are taking now,I understand how easy it is to say,"just one more",but where that leaves you at the end of the month is worse off than where you are with the already insufficient supply of meds to manage your pain.But I'm aware that you already know this.

    Every day I put my daily supply of meds in my little holder,and though nothing I take is going to kill my pain this is,and I know from going without before,that this is soooo much better than nothing,that I am never and have never even thought of taking more than I should.For two reasons,I don't want to mess with my tolerance,and I want to always be ready just incase that phone call comes.The one where my Drs office calls asking for a pill count.

    Most CP patients wouldn't know where to buy pills from a dealer.I'm sure there are a few exceptions to every rule,but those dealers aren't selling to patients and it isn't the patients who are buying..for the most part.
  • I hate making blanket statements, but the guidelines in most Chronic Pain guidline manuals for Dr's, state that we should not be getting IR meds, most of the time. Yes, use them to titrate, but switch them over to ER in a week or so.

    And Yes - I had to copy off the internet - the guidelines for both my Province - and another. I pointed out that our Prov Guide - was 15 years out of date - and 18 years old in research.

    Next appt he followed my lead - because he could see that what was presented made sense, and I was not bashing him to see things my way, just asking him to read, and see if it provided better. In the end, he agreed and we kept going back and forth for a bit. I was asked at several occasions, "what did I think would fix things." I also told him at all instances of that, that there was nothing except a new spine - that would fix what I have, so end of story, end of whining, lets just make things the best we can. Control pain - so I can enjoy somethings. No - I do not need a pill - in order to do everything, but I do need to reduce the pain mountain, and then I am only dealing with the peaks.
  • Just a thought... Make a list of your daily activites along with the pain rating that your in. There are some pain journals which can be download off the internet. Put that under the nose of your dr. It will be hard for him to ignore it.

    I'm suffering from central pain and the morphine ER helps. They don'e knock me out though. I'm sure you know about Nuerontin and Lyrica. I hope you feel better and get some relief.
  • I see her Monday, so I am going to take some notes to give her about my spikes, but they are generally every four hours when my meds wear off - no matter what I'm doing, the nerve pain comes creeping in and screeches "I'M BACK!!!"
    I am going to ask about taking one low dose ER pill of some sort during the night when I won't care if I'm dopey and see if that helps. Then I could take the others every 4 hours with no problem. I'm hoping if I can show her it is every 4 hours, maybe she'll come around to my way of thinking. I have to be alert at 6 a.m. to drive into work everyday tho, so gotta be careful with that too! What a "Pain in the Postierior" Literally! :)
  • I have been on ER meds, for a long time. One thing I can tell you is that they don't make you loopy. It does take a short time to adjust, but within a couple days, I have found things to settle.

    The best explanation - is that each day, we have a pain mountain that is built, by the actions we take and the reactions of what we decide to do - and then not do.

    For myself - the ER meds cuts the bottom off the pain mountain. So with the bottom cut off, all I am left with - is these pain hills. For them, I use all of my other tools, and a little IR meds if needed.

    Take Care!
  • Agree with Centurion. Unless you are overmedicated, you shouldn't feel loopy on long-acting meds. That was my point earlier.

    However, you do have to watch what else you're taking with them, if you're on any benzodiazapines or if you drink alcohol, you may have to change your habits.

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